Abdel Amine Mohammed [ENG]

What word comes to your mind when you think of the Humboldtforum / Berliner Schloss? Please explain.

Concerning the Humboldt Forum, I just find it remarkable how much money is put into that project, hundreds of millions. All to put art on a pedestal, most of which was stolen from former colonies. And regarding debates concerning that topic between those working on the project and the people who are affected – that is, people from the different colonies and also various action groups engaging with the subject: I find it quite outrageous that the city of Berlin does not take a clear stance, that it adopts a position that doesn’t lead anywhere. As if everything was settled and resolved, which is not the case.

Therefore, I think that for one, the project doesn’t have to take place at all. But unfortunately, it has advanced to a point where it can’t be stopped anymore. But the least one could do would be to listen to the voices who do take a position, such as in regards to the return of thousands of stolen art objects from former colonies or countries that were robbed under colonial occupation. And these objects are now in the basements of museums or in the Infobox on the Humboldt Forum. That is what comes to my mind spontaneously.

Do you think that Germany should pay reparations to the Herero and Nama communities that were affected by and dispossessed during the genocide from 1904-08? Please elaborate.

Reparations are always a difficult subject, for the sole reason that the aggressors, the perpetrators of the colonial era, are afraid of handing over privileges, afraid of losing face and paying money to the victims or the victims’ descendants. Well, I get that there are reservations or rather a status-quo stance, but this is not at all justified. I think one should first look at what reparations are actually about. It’s not always about money. Most of the time it is also about developing a certain attitude towards what happened, and improving our coexistence in the community even just a little bit. It is nobody’s interest to regard one another as enemies, neither for the Germans nor for the Namibians or more precisely the descendants of the Herero and Nama. It hasn’t been done like this in other contexts. But because issues linked to colonialism are trivialized, there is this attitude as if it was normal or natural. It is not normal or natural at all. One needs to force oneself to address things the way they really are. A genocide occurred . That has to be discussed. Efforts have to be made to find a compromise. That compromise can’t be covered or replaced by aid in the sense of development cooperation. Instead it is indispensable to speak about what happened. It was a genocide. And the ways of dealing with genocide afterwards are clearly defined – by law but also by common sense. Detours or maintaining the status quo are attitudes that don’t help. But direct and honest dealing with the issue would.

Do you think that a memorial and informational centrum concerning the topic slavery, colonialism and racism should be built in Berlin? Please elaborate.

Yes, well a central memorial and a commemoration site on the topic of enslavement and colonialism should exist here in Berlin, and not only here but in Germany in general. Let alone for the fact that again and again while I am giving guided tours about colonial repercussions in Berlin there is always a certain reservation and lack of knowledge, because it is not an issue in school education nor in the societal discourse. That’s why it is treated with little attention. Memorials and commemoration sites won’t solve the issue, but at least they create a certain public awareness, because many people will visit the memorials and commemoration sites and that’s how they will be confronted with the issue and how they will become more aware. And certain stupid comments and assumptions will have no place. If, for example, one asks me “do you come from one of our former colonies?” well, that demonstrates the ignorance of the actual meaning of colony and colonialism. I think I wouldn’t be asked that question, if I were a white Jew. They wouldn’t have asked me “to which concentration camp were your parents deported?” I find that very problematic. It is being trivialized and even mocked. The term has become hip. It is employed in an old way, in a colonial fashion. Therefore, what happened during the colonial era, during colonialism, in the colonies, is not being taken seriously. Even though then as now one can read about it in books, the engagement with the topic and its reception are banal. That needs to be different. That needs to be changed.

What’s your take on the many human remains from the Global South that are kept in German museums until today?

Well about human remains… Whenever I need to talk about it, I think: this can’t be true. How is it possible that we still have to debate it before one even understands how horrible it is, how disgusting it is! One first needs to clarify that the bones we’re talking about are from humans. For example, in the case of Namibia, these people died in concentration camps. They were beheaded and other body parts were also cut off, then cooked and women and children were charged with removing the skin from the skulls and other body parts. But of course there is also the other side of so called “researchers”, who keep doing research on these human remains. And I am asking myself: “What are they still researching now in the 21st century?” That any scientist or so-called scientist can still imagine these remains as his research object. That is simply outrageous! And I say it again, something like that is only possible in a colonial context and especially in the African context. If those were other peoples’ remains, one would find a way to return them in no time. It would have been done a long time ago. But I’m afraid that it is in a colonial context and especially in the African context. Only in that context is this tolerated. To me this is.. it is simply… well, it’s … pathetic, it is disgusting to even talk about begging someone to hand back and return such mortal remains. That shouldn’t happen in Germany.

According to you, how important is the equal and conceptional contribution of descendants of colonized people to handle the colonial past (i.e. negotiations regarding reparations, museums, exhibitions, representation in schoolbooks, street renaming etc.)?

With regard to dealing with that history, I think the most important priority or necessity is that descendants from former colonies should be involved in this process in a leading position. They should be given the opportunity to develop the concepts of how to work in this context. It must not be the other way around, in a top-down manner. It must come from the “victim groups” in brackets. This is the racism-free way of working and the only legitimized procedure I can imagine in such a context. The other way around would only lead to trivialization or even exclusion. If they [the descendants] are not part of it, we won’t advance. That’s not okay. It’s not okay at all. One should also look how things work elsewhere. I don’t believe that the federal government prescribed to the Jewish community how the Shoa should be dealt with. And there is no lack of willingness to be involved or of competent leadership in the African community or other communities. All the initiatives and events that take place within these communities today are proof of that, not to mention the groups of supporters who are all very committed to the topic and deal with it every day. There is no lack of expertise, there is no lack of initiative and there isn’t a lack of know-how concerning the possibilities for handling that subject either. There should only be the good will of politicians to allot a budget for what would be required. There are many examples from the communities for looking at what is being criticized and how can we work on it. There are already many templates that should simply be used. And within the communities there are also people who have been developing such concepts for years.